Dear readers,
I have been having an on-going dialogue with Jose in Texas via email, as he used the ‘Contact Us’ page instead of commenting on one of the posts. I have asked his permission to post our dialogue, and he has granted it. Following is that dialogue:
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Name: Jose
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Comments: I would like to talk or chat with other dads who have spouses who left with another woman. I cannot understand how or why after 25 years of marriage, how did this happen? Why was I blind to this in our marriage? I trusted my wife, and didn’t think she would do this to me…
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Sent: Thu, January 7, 2010 4:46:51 PM
Subject: Divorced Catholic Dads web site inquiry
Jose,
I am REALLY sorry to hear that your wife left with another woman, particularly given that you were married so long.
Yes, she did it to you, but in a way she did not… She has done it to herself and the devastation she will endure will be terrible. I can only pity her and pray for her that she will not lose her soul to her disordered passions.
Why were you blind to this? I have learned painfully that I cannot know another person’s heart and even if I could, I am often too absorbed in my own interests that I miss a lot of the signals and warnings. I have learned that only deep prayer can keep my heart, mind and soul sensitive enough to be aware of other’s needs. The more I pray, the more aware I am.
Jose, do you mind if we put this discussion on the comments on the web site? Then others will be attracted to your comments and you will be able to chat with others who have had the same experience.
Let me know.
Peace
Dave at Divorced Catholic Dads
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Sent: Friday, January 08, 2010 2:51 PM
To:dave
Subject: Re: Divorced Catholic Dads web site inquiry
That’s fine….I want the whole world to know what kind of woman this is…..
I know that God has a plan to show her a lesson, and I hope it’s not through the kids..
I know vengeance is His and it is mighty & swift….
She didn’t even want to go speak to our priest at our church.. she noted ” I DONT WANT TO GO SEE THAT MAN”!!! It’s awful how she has lost her faith and a sense of religion in her heart….
THANKS
Jose
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To: jose
Sent: Fri, January 8, 2010 9:55:16 PM
Subject: RE: Divorced Catholic Dads web site inquiry
Jose,
And so it falls to you to be what God, what Christ, calls you to be, alone. He calls you to be holy and the example of Christianity to your wife and children. It is especially now, in this time of your greatest suffering, that He holds out the greatest graces to you.
Be the best Catholic man you can be. Now is the time for you to be a man. A man of Christ. Just think of how He responded both to the prostitutes and to the soldiers who tortured and killed him. He was compassionate. And that is our example.
Pray, pray, pray and then pray more for courage, strength and wisdom. And your brother Divorced Dads will pray with and for you as well.
Dave
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Sent: Saturday, January 09, 2010 7:25 PM
To: dave
Subject: Re: Divorced Catholic Dads web site inquiry
Its that I’m hurting so much….I’m trying not to go to the lawyer and file for the divorce yet..I’m still hoping that God will intervene, in just as small as a mustard seed.
My kids at time are rude & ugly to me when I call them…I just blow it off so
I can hear & speak to them…My son called me last night to ask me for money, he had his car impounded for outstanding tickets…I told him I would help him, but he later called me and told me no after all….I just wish I could talk to my wife to apologize and communicate with her..She doesn’t want to have anymore conversation with me. I asked my daughter and she said mom says no…I feel like their intent is to break me down emotionally…I’m praying constantly to keep from this happening…
I wish there were some more brothers here in HOUSTON to help me…
Regards
Jose
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To: jose
Sent: Sun, January 10, 2010 10:42:03 AM
Subject: RE: Divorced Catholic Dads web site inquiry
Jose,
I understand the hurt. Actually, my wife left me 5 times before she finally left the last time and filed for divorce.
If you are “still hoping God will intervene”, then in my experience, I found I needed to open myself as much as I could to hear Him. So I went to confession and Mass to receive the Eucharist. I did not want any stain of sin clouding my interior vision or my ability for my heart to hear His word to me. As I said before, God has great graces for you in this time of suffering. He will never allow anything in our lives that He does not also provide sufficient graces if we will be open to them.
This is a time when it is VERY important to be in tune with the graces God has for you in this time of suffering. Offer your emotional, psychological and human suffering for your sins and the sins of your wife. Yes, you will suffer in your hurt and react humanly, and that is only normal. Or you can suffer in your hurt and react with the grace of God – spiritually. Just recognize that your emotions are normal human reactions, but separate the spirit from the flesh within yourself. Let the suffering rip your flesh apart from your spirit and put your will in the spiritual side.
I had no one to help me. Many times I cried out to God for someone here locally to help me, but there was no one. No family, no friends. Just me and Jesus and Mary and my parish priest. Can you find a parish priest who can help?
I will still work at putting this dialog on the blog so that perhaps someone in Houston will see it and maybe put the two of you in touch.
Peace
Dave
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Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 12:13 AM
To: dave
Subject: Re: Divorced Catholic Dads web site inquiry
Could you explain to me a little bit more in detail how I can separate the emotional, psychological, and physical sense… I feel like I want to give up on my kids since they protected her and went on her side. My priest at church told me I have been betrayed 3 times: 1- my wife 2- next, my kids 3rd – my friend from work whom I introduced to my wife, the lesbian.
Everyone else around me tells me I didn’t do anything wrong, it was my wife who just left like a thief in the night. She never gave me a chance to try to work things out. I kind of suspected it might have been her boss if not the lesbian friend . She met someone who was able to give her the intimacy we lacked in our marriage.
Jose
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To: jose
Sent: Mon, January 11, 2010 5:38:49 AM
Subject: RE: Divorced Catholic Dads web site inquiry
Jose,
I want you to do a short exercise. Say a short prayer – Our Father or Hail Mary and ask the Spirit to help you. Then, for a moment, close your eyes and then ‘step away from your body’. Look at what you see. A hurting guy and ………. Describe it to yourself. That is your humanity suffering – emotional, psychological and physical. But that is NOT your soul, your spirit, which is with you as you stepped away.
Then you can see what Jesus sees. A guy who is hurting emotionally, psychologically and physically, even. But that is JUST your humanity, which is not eternal and will die some day. Your soul, the spiritual part of you is what will live forever, and the destiny of your soul is based on the choices you make – your decisions, particularly at this moment.
When you do this, then you have a way to separate the spirit from the flesh. And you can have pity for the humanity part of you without getting sucked into letting it drive your thoughts and actions. Pray for the strength to go there often. Then the great graces God is offering you in this moment of great suffering will give you peace and sanity. You can, with God’s grace, look at the situation with peace, objectivity, and detachment. Pray for detachment.
Pray for God’s wisdom. The world has no wisdom compared to God’s. Look around you at your own condition and the condition of the world. This is wisdom? It is pathetic. No, God means to give you wisdom. His. And He is with you. NOW. And at every moment.
OK, so you, like me are a sinner and were not the best you could be in your marriage, and lacked some degree of intimacy. EVERY man who ever was married and walked the earth with the exception of St. Joseph, was the same way in their marriage – not perfect for what our wives needed. You have lots of company. It is normal to fail in what we were called to by the Sacrament of Marriage. God is supposed to be the Third Person in our marriage around whom we both center our relationship. So, as you look at your own sin and weakness, your failings in the marriage that were not what Christ called you to, then be honest with yourself and Him and make a confession. So I disagree with your family and friends: yes, you did do something wrong in your marriage, but every husband can say the same thing. Start with the realization that your sin and weakness was a contributor to the situation, just as your wife’s was. And make a good confession. That is key to coming to peace. It is the building block, the foundation.
I would say it perhaps differently than your priest. Your wife betrayed herself, the Sacrament of Marriage, and Jesus, not you. You are not her god and were never meant to be. That is ‘possessive’ of her and the relationship. In marriage, we give ourselves to each other to be helpmates and stewards to each other and our children to get to heaven. We do not own each other or our children. That is the disorder of our culture. We become so possessive of our wives and children that we become addicted in a way, and when they are taken from us for whatever reason, then we act like drug addicts going into withdrawal. Sound familiar?
To say she betrayed you is correct perhaps from the human standpoint, but not from the spiritual or eternal standpoint. No, she did not betray you, if you understand what I mean. She betrayed only herself, the Sacrament and God. Pray for her conversion.
And your children did not betray you. They were manipulated, perhaps and maybe even, seeing the marriage from outside, saw where the love they were receiving was coming from because you were gone working or whatever. But, again, they did not betray you. When they are old enough to reason right from wrong and have attained spiritual maturity, then they will see the truth, for whatever that is.
And the lesbian did not betray you, but rather, herself and God. And giving in to her weaknesses and lusts, led someone else astray. Pray for her conversion. God’s justice for the unrepentant in eternity (hell) is not something I would wish on anyone.
So no one has betrayed you. All, including you, just like the rest of us have fallen in sin and weakness. We betray ourselves, the Sacraments and God. Once you can understand that, that no one has betrayed you, then you can see more clearly. We are all responsible for our own decisions. You cannot blame yourself for your wife’s decisions, or your children’s – or anyone else’s decisions. You can only take responsibility for your own decisions.
Decide today.
Decide to let go.
Decide to love.
Decide to pray for conversions for yourself, your wife, your children, the lesbian and everyone supporting them.
Decide to admit the truth about your own sin and weaknesses.
Decide today to struggle for holiness as God is calling you to, particularly now, in this moment.
Decide today not to blame anyone.
Decide today to raise the eyes of your heart and mind to God many times throughout the day and ask Him how you should think and act.
Decide today to accept the grace He is offering you.
Decide to let every action be guided by Him.
Make those decisions today. And tomorrow and the next day. And EVERY day.
Then Christ, who is the Answer to every dilemma, every question and every struggle, will give you His wisdom and His Peace, a peace the world cannot understand.
The Peace of Christ be with you.
Dave
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From: jose
Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 11:11 PM
To: dave
Subject: Re: Divorced Catholic Dads web site inquiry
WOW DAVE,
I never really envisioned my soul and detachment of humanity on myself in that light. What comes to mind, is that a lot of this sin could have been avoided. I myself brought it upon myself for sins not confessed and forgiven. Did I really wholeheartedly ask a true confession for my past transgressions? Is God showing me and opening my heart up for a true contrite heart to make myself pure for his works? Does he have a plan he’s going to set me upon to walk through? I have only concerns for the relationship that has been scarred with the children. It will only take time like you say until they reach maturity and can grasp the truth “VERITAS”.
I can only hope and try to improve my relationship with the children , when they are ready to come around. At different times I have reached out to them, and each time I end up getting hurt and feeling worse. I asked them to attend Mass this past Sunday and I invited them to breakfast. My daughter never hugged me or spoke to me, and the whole time she was text messaging with her friend or her mom.. My oldest son was on the defense with me and just started arguing about issues going on between me & my wife. I just feel like just leaving them alone for right now and not to persist anymore contact. I thank you for taking time out of your schedule to help me and guide me with your knowledge and spirit of our Father..
Thank You
Jose
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Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2010 10:56 AM
To: ‘jose sainz’
Subject: RE: Divorced Catholic Dads web site inquiry
Jose,
WOW God! You are a ‘beautiful’ soul! Open to hearing God’s word to you. If I as a poor schlock and sinner myself can be a conduit, then fine, but it is you who are open and receptive to Him.
Yes, we can both say that much of our sin could have been avoided. All sin can be avoided. And a “humble and contrite heart He will not spurn” as scripture says. I grow in humility, it seems, only by being humiliated humanly before God, others and before myself. I am not the great and wonderful guy I think I am in my humanity. An openness to being humiliated, instead of anger and resentment at being humiliated, can lead to the virtue of humility if one is prayerful about it.
And so, our wives and family leaving us is certainly a humiliation. Seeing my sin in truth for what it is, is a humiliation. I can never throw a rock at someone else or condemn them, because in the depth of my heart I know my sin and how much worse I am than they could ever be – even if their sin is so open and gross. My sin is worse because I know God, I have a relationship with Him, and still I commit sin and offend Him terribly. Who is the worst – the one who is insane and commits murder or one who has full use of their own mind and plans it and carries it out?
So I have gay, lesbian and playboy friends, but I see their sin, their pain they are obviously reacting out of and only have pity for them and pray. “Lord, they do not know what they are doing.” But I know what I am doing when I choose sin over obedience. Who is the worse sinner? I am. The realization brings humiliation, insight into the truth, repentance and freedom as I embrace the Mercy of God through His Sacraments. Then I can stand firm in my faith and be the silent, and sometimes not so silent, witness even as I reach out in friendship and love, praying to draw them into the arms of Christ as someone else did for me.
With truth, humility and God’s abundant Mercy, then I can be pure for His works as you say so accurately. Repentance and reparation for my sin is the starting point for me to begin a renewed climb of the mountain of holiness. The mountain we are all called to climb from our baptism. Jose CAN be holy and grow in holiness each day. He calls each of us to that. It is not just for clergy or the saints. We are all called to holiness. And He will provide the grace to do it.
This is your moment of grace, in the depth of your pain and suffering. Open your heart to it at this moment! Rejoice! He will fill an empty vessel. It is your time of ‘kyros’ – your time of grace! Empty yourself completely before HIM and be open to being filled with Him and His grace. See with new eyes, hear with new ears, and love with a new heart!
Ezekiel 36:26
And I will give you a new heart, and I will put a new spirit in you.
I will take out your stony, stubborn heart and give you a tender, responsive heart.
And if you are serving Him with all your heart, mind and soul as scripture says, He will take care of the salvation of your children, and perhaps even heal them in secret ways at the appropriate time. He WILL take care of the loved ones of his dedicated servants.
It was a good thing to reach out to your children. They DO need you, even if they do not know it or show it. YOU must be the calm, peaceful and silent witness to the value and centrality of your Catholic faith and Jesus Christ in your life. ESPECIALLY now, when they are living in the situation they are in, you must affirm your faith. By the quiet witness of your life and behavior. NOW is the time of ‘metanoia’ for you, the time for radical conversion. Let them not hear it but see it.
In the end, I always make sure that whatever the dilemma, my children know that I turn to my faith for the answer. Christ IS the answer
Be exceedingly patient, kind and forgiving of them. They are angry and they have shown it by their behavior. That is perfectly normal and natural. They have a right before God to be angry, right? You and your wife failed them, yourselves and God. Stay away from loosing yourself in your ‘hurt and feeling worse’. That is the poison of a fallen humanity. I deserved all the anger and frustration that came my way. And actually, if they had known the depth of my sin, I deserved more. Even my multiply handicapped, retarded son who has such a beautiful, sweet and innocent spirit was angry about the divorce and I was forced to deal with that. Talk about humiliating.
Your witness of kindness, peace, forgiveness and love is very much needed in your children’s lives right now. Be as Christ would be to them – merciful, understanding and loving. No need to argue with them. You do not need to defend yourself. Just acknowledge their feelings, anger and frustration with you both. It is the truth of the moment, and even if some of their perceptions are incorrect, the feelings are not.
Be you, but make sure that you are striving to be a model of a father and husband who has failed, yes, but is struggling to grow in faith, hope, love and holiness. Words are not needed. Ask St. Joseph for his help and model him.
God will work miracles in your life if you stick to the path of serving Him, of that I am sure. Look for them, but whether they can be seen and their timing is up to Him.
Peace,
Dave